Mr. P Posted October 31, 2022 Share Posted October 31, 2022 Right the whole team improved their play down the stretch and in the playoffs. But for the majority of the season, the o-line was shitty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nas Posted October 31, 2022 Share Posted October 31, 2022 I love Eli as much as the next fan but let's not pretend he was not a turnover machine himself. Didn't he average like 1 interception per game over the span of his career? I'm reminded that this is a team sport. Just from my own observation, I feel DJ has been a better QB so far in his career than Eli given all the pieces around each player. I'm not saying DJ is the second coming of Christ, but players do get better with more experience... We just saw Geno Smith play really well. The Seahawks took out our running game and challenged us to throw it... there were no catchers out there. And the 2 fumbles are what killed us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mastershake Posted October 31, 2022 Share Posted October 31, 2022 2 hours ago, The P said: Right the whole team improved their play down the stretch and in the playoffs. But for the majority of the season, the o-line was shitty. Yeah that's essentially what I'm saying. They really came through down the stretch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mastershake Posted October 31, 2022 Share Posted October 31, 2022 2 hours ago, Nas said: I love Eli as much as the next fan but let's not pretend he was not a turnover machine himself. Didn't he average like 1 interception per game over the span of his career? I'm reminded that this is a team sport. Just from my own observation, I feel DJ has been a better QB so far in his career than Eli given all the pieces around each player. I'm not saying DJ is the second coming of Christ, but players do get better with more experience... We just saw Geno Smith play really well. The Seahawks took out our running game and challenged us to throw it... there were no catchers out there. And the 2 fumbles are what killed us. At the very least, DJ has been put in one of the worst situations I've ever seen a drafted QB be placed in (minus maybe Tim Couch in 1999). - 3 different coaches - The worst and most inconsistent OLs in giants history the last 4-5 years (really going back further, but these OLs were abysmal) - Talent around him not there and/or frequently injured (e.g. Barkley, Shepherd, Toney, Golladay) - Engram, the guy who doesn't know if he's playing football or volleyball, drove at least 2 or 3 of his interceptions. Plus his own injuries as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nas Posted October 31, 2022 Share Posted October 31, 2022 5 minutes ago, mastershake said: At the very least, DJ has been put in one of the worst situations I've ever seen a drafted QB be placed in (minus maybe Tim Couch in 1999). - 3 different coaches - The worst and most inconsistent OLs in giants history the last 4-5 years (really going back further, but these OLs were abysmal) - Talent around him not there and/or frequently injured (e.g. Barkley, Shepherd, Toney, Golladay) - Engram, the guy who doesn't know if he's playing football or volleyball, drove at least 2 or 3 of his interceptions. Plus his own injuries as well. Yep. And his own injuries mainly stem from him trying to make something out of nothing... I'm no fan of a QB taking hits like that... It will ensure his durability will be that of a running back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. P Posted October 31, 2022 Share Posted October 31, 2022 17 minutes ago, mastershake said: Yeah that's essentially what I'm saying. They really came through down the stretch. Eli had to have an mvp caliber season for them to even still be in contention down the stretch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mastershake Posted October 31, 2022 Share Posted October 31, 2022 9 minutes ago, The P said: Eli had to have an mvp caliber season for them to even still be in contention down the stretch. That's fair, but again, he had solid talent around him that year. Guys like Nicks and Cruz were studs before their injury issues, for instance. The D was also clutch down the stretch too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazedDogs Posted October 31, 2022 Author Share Posted October 31, 2022 3 hours ago, mastershake said: Go back and watch like the last 6 games (minus the SF game) where they went on a tear, and where the running game was also generally good. Plus in general, we had the 9th ranked offense that season by points. They played well down the stretch. It wasn't just Eli. Go check out the highlights of key plays in those games and he has loads of time to throw in most instances, plus again the ground game. uh, lol, well again, I literally did go back and watch those games. I stand by my critique of the 2011 OL. Even playing 'better' later in the season doesn't equate to good or adequate. They were fucking horrible at the end, and abysmal at the beginning. And we were so fucking lucky they only faced one team with a legit pass rush during that run. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nas Posted October 31, 2022 Share Posted October 31, 2022 2 minutes ago, CrazedDogs said: uh, lol, well again, I literally did go back and watch those games. I stand by my critique of the 2011 OL. Even playing 'better' later in the season doesn't equate to good or adequate. They were fucking horrible at the end, and abysmal at the beginning. And we were so fucking lucky they only faced one team with a legit pass rush during that run. No, agreed. They had to peel Eli off the turf in SF multiple times. I guess the argument is that at least Eli had Nicks, Cruz, Manningham, and (forgot the the of our TE back then... reminds of Bellinger). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazedDogs Posted October 31, 2022 Author Share Posted October 31, 2022 19 minutes ago, Nas said: No, agreed. They had to peel Eli off the turf in SF multiple times. I guess the argument is that at least Eli had Nicks, Cruz, Manningham, and (forgot the the of our TE back then... reminds of Bellinger). yeah you'll get no argument from me on that, that WR group was miles beyond what we have now. They were as good or better than that OL was bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mastershake Posted October 31, 2022 Share Posted October 31, 2022 Give Jones that 2011 team with Cruz, Nicks, Manningham, Bradshaw, Jacobs, etc and even with that OL, Jones does far better than now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. P Posted October 31, 2022 Share Posted October 31, 2022 5 minutes ago, mastershake said: Give Jones that 2011 team with Cruz, Nicks, Manningham, Bradshaw, Jacobs, etc and even with that OL, Jones does far better than now. He does far better than now, but not nearly as good as Eli did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TaylorBanksCarsonVanPelt Posted November 1, 2022 Share Posted November 1, 2022 Have watched 54 years of Giants football and DJ is a decent game manager Eli was a once in a lifetime talent No shame in being Danny Kanell that is what DJ is Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iceman_NYG Posted November 1, 2022 Share Posted November 1, 2022 14 hours ago, CrazedDogs said: yeah you'll get no argument from me on that, that WR group was miles beyond what we have now. They were as good or better than that OL was bad. The Boss Man! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iceman_NYG Posted November 1, 2022 Share Posted November 1, 2022 DJ needs 1 good quality WR to stretch the field - that automatically opens up a variety of things we can try with a All-World RB and mobile QB. Did anyone see that fucking FAKE Fade Route that DK ran yesterday, which resulted in the Walker TD?? Fucking hell. The CB just totally bit on it and didnt even look back to see that the ball had been handed off. Brilliant fake Fade route Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazedDogs Posted November 1, 2022 Author Share Posted November 1, 2022 8 hours ago, Iceman_NYG said: The Boss Man! I think in 2011 it was Jake Ballard. Boss had a good run, hated to see him leave in free agency. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueInCanada Posted November 1, 2022 Share Posted November 1, 2022 1 hour ago, CrazedDogs said: I think in 2011 it was Jake Ballard. Boss had a good run, hated to see him leave in free agency. Boss was a hell of a TE and a great safety net for Eli but the dude was always hurt lol don't think he ever finished a full season, but played when it mattered during the SB run. Ballard was another who's career was cut short by injuries his was an ACL tear? Or broken leg? Can't recall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sephiroth Posted November 1, 2022 Share Posted November 1, 2022 On 10/31/2022 at 9:38 AM, Nas said: I love Eli as much as the next fan but let's not pretend he was not a turnover machine himself. Didn't he average like 1 interception per game over the span of his career? I'm reminded that this is a team sport. Just from my own observation, I feel DJ has been a better QB so far in his career than Eli given all the pieces around each player. I'm not saying DJ is the second coming of Christ, but players do get better with more experience... We just saw Geno Smith play really well. The Seahawks took out our running game and challenged us to throw it... there were no catchers out there. And the 2 fumbles are what killed us. I loved Eli, but the whole "he made everyone around him better" argument I don't think holds any water. His last few seasons were terrible... not because he was a bad player, but because the team surrounded him with garbage. Look at Aaron Rodgers today and you'll see something similar (though Eli's teams were much worse towards the end). It's true that the players that left the team didn't do as well once they left, but that's because most of them were on their fifth ACL tear. It's a team sport; your good play can make others play better, but that has its limits. No one guy is going to just automatically elevate the play of everyone else that much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. P Posted November 1, 2022 Share Posted November 1, 2022 Here is a closer breakdown of every Manning touchdown pass: REGULAR SEASON (366) 1: Jerell Adams, Bennie Fowler, Wayne Gallman, Henry Hynoski, TJ Jones, Cody Latimer, Louis Murphy, Bear Pascoe, Marcellus Rivers, Adrien Robinson, Da’rell Scott, Hunter Sharp, Russell Shepard, Visanthe Schiancoe, Scott Simonson, Golden Tate, Derrick Ward, David Wilson, Corey Washington 2: Tim Carter, Derek Hagan, Madison Hedgecock, Rashad Jennings, Jerrell Jernigan, Darcy Johnson, Sinorice Moss, Preston Parker 3: Tiki Barber, Saquon Barkley, Travis Beckum, Ahmad Bradshaw, Rhett Ellison, Darius Slayton, Tavarres King 4: Jake Ballard, Daniel Fells, Brandon Jacobs, Roger Lewis, Brandon Myers, Will Tye, David Tyree, Shane Vereen 5: Martellus Bennett, Dwayne Harris, Domenik Hixon 9: Larry Donnell, Evan Engram 11: Steve Smith 14: Sterling Shepard 17: Amani Toomer 18: Kevin Boss, Mario Manningham 19: Jeremy Shockey 20: Rueben Randle 25: Victor Cruz 26: Hakeem Nicks 33: Plaxico Burress 44: Odell Beckham PLAYOFFS (18) 4: Nicks 3: Burress, Manningham, Toomer 1: Cruz, King, Jacobs, Pascoe, Tyree Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herc Posted November 1, 2022 Share Posted November 1, 2022 I miss Dwayne Harris—especially this week Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. P Posted November 1, 2022 Share Posted November 1, 2022 We could use Leapin Larry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueInCanada Posted November 1, 2022 Share Posted November 1, 2022 You almost forget how much chemistry Eli and Odell had. Not to mention Odells playmaking ability. What I'd give to have Odell in his prime now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueInCanada Posted November 1, 2022 Share Posted November 1, 2022 Seeing David Wilsons name makes me sad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazedDogs Posted November 1, 2022 Author Share Posted November 1, 2022 11 minutes ago, BlueInCanada said: Seeing David Wilsons name makes me sad Both for what might have been, and because we should have been all in on the OL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. P Posted November 1, 2022 Share Posted November 1, 2022 20 minutes ago, BlueInCanada said: You almost forget how much chemistry Eli and Odell had. Not to mention Odells playmaking ability. What I'd give to have Odell in his prime now. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=-hVjJEFmal4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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