Treehugger Posted February 7, 2015 Share Posted February 7, 2015 Has everyone forgotten about Cruz? With Beckham, Cruz and Randle you'd be hard pressed to justify money or a high pick at WR. I like the idea of Landon Collins at #9. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragon Posted February 7, 2015 Author Share Posted February 7, 2015 Cruz is coming off a significant knee injury and if I remember correctly he was injured at the end of 2013 as well. There's too much uncertainty when it comes to Cruz's health. And Randle is maddeningly inconsistent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Treehugger Posted February 7, 2015 Share Posted February 7, 2015 I don't think there's any lingering uncertainty about Cruz's health. They also paid him and will want to see a ROI. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herc Posted February 7, 2015 Share Posted February 7, 2015 Well his injury is not just your classic torn acl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragon Posted February 7, 2015 Author Share Posted February 7, 2015 I don't think there's any lingering uncertainty about Cruz's health. They also paid him and will want to see a ROI. While we agree on the ROI we currently don't know if he'll be back at 100% or if his speed/maneuverability (which were his biggest strengths) have been diminished because of it. Either way... my desire to draft a WR is due to Randle's performance more than Cruz's health. I'd like to see another dominant WR to pair up with OBJ for at least the next 4 years at a reasonable price. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nas Posted February 8, 2015 Share Posted February 8, 2015 Cruz is coming off a significant knee injury and if I remember correctly he was injured at the end of 2013 as well. There's too much uncertainty when it comes to Cruz's health. And Randle is maddeningly inconsistent. That maybe true but really who do we have opposite of JPP at DE? I have a hunch that's where the Giants maybe heading although I know the BPA takes precedence... I just don't see us going WR (in agreement with Tree) and I do think Cruz comes back and plays really well especially with ODB commanding more attention than Nicks ever did. I think the Giants go for defense in the 1st pick... DE or LB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Storm Posted February 8, 2015 Share Posted February 8, 2015 And it's not like Cruz has played particularly well when he had been healthy, these past two years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragon Posted February 8, 2015 Author Share Posted February 8, 2015 That maybe true but really who do we have opposite of JPP at DE? I have a hunch that's where the Giants maybe heading although I know the BPA takes precedence... I just don't see us going WR (in agreement with Tree) and I do think Cruz comes back and plays really well especially with ODB commanding more attention than Nicks ever did. I think the Giants go for defense in the 1st pick... DE or LB. Right now we have nothing, but that's why I named a guy like Hughes as someone I'd be looking at in free agency. I'm looking at Eli coming into what'll probably be the last years of his career in NY and he has the most dominant wr he's ever had in OBJ, but behind him we have an injured Cruz, an inconsistent Randle and Parker, and a very unproven Washington that only seems to see the field when MacAdoo wants to run a fade. I named Cooper, Parker, and Coates, but even a guy like Rashad Greene (homer pick) in the 2nd or 3rd would be a hell of a player across from OBJ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. P Posted February 8, 2015 Share Posted February 8, 2015 I think we have to work in the theory that Cruz isn't coming back. From what I've heard from my woman (physical therapist) and my actual physical therapist. That injury is going to be hard to come back from, and at least this year he will not look the same at all. Especially when you look at what his strengths are, his change of direction and explosion. I think if he plays like the Cruz of old it won't be this upcoming season. Hopefully I'm wrong though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gman329 Posted February 8, 2015 Share Posted February 8, 2015 I think we have to work in the theory that Cruz isn't coming back. From what I've heard from my woman (physical therapist) and my actual physical therapist. That injury is going to be hard to come back from, and at least this year he will not look the same at all. Especially when you look at what his strengths are, his change of direction and explosion. I think if he plays like the Cruz of old it won't be this upcoming season. Hopefully I'm wrong though. I have heard and read much the same thing.....which is why Eddie Royal caught my eye on the Free Agent list. He could be an affordable option and I think he'd be very good working out of the slot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Treehugger Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 And it's not like Cruz has played particularly well when he had been healthy, these past two years. But he played his best (which was stellar) when there was a legit #1 WR opposite him. I'm pretty excited about Beckham/Cruz. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragon Posted February 9, 2015 Author Share Posted February 9, 2015 Trust me... I would be too if Cruz had an arm injury or something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sephiroth Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 I can't think of one player at the WR position that came back from that injury and played as well as he had. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herc Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 well next year is pivotal year for him. 2016 offseason is when it becomes feasible to cut him. i'd be happy to have him be an above-average possession receiver at worst but that probably won't justify a 9 million dollar cap hit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gmenroc Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 Yeah, the WR picks are to hedge against the Cruz injury AND to refill the pipeline should we let Randle move on after the season. As for the thoughts on going defense in the first, I agree. We have a shortage at safety, so Collins is making more ad more sense. The lightweight DE/LB hybrids...I'm praying the Giants pass up. At DE, you need a guy who can hold the point of attack and at 240, I don't see that happening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nas Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 I can't think of one player at the WR position that came back from that injury and played as well as he had. Yea, I hope Cruz isn't rushed (or he doesn't rush himself back)... I cringe thinking about Steve Smith. Now that I think about it, the injury was really bad and in probably the worst spot... I can see the Giants addressing the WR issue this off-season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gmenroc Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 Yea, I hope Cruz isn't rushed (or he doesn't rush himself back)... I cringe thinking about Steve Smith. Now that I think about it, the injury was really bad and in probably the worst spot... I can see the Giants addressing the WR issue this off-season. It'd be a mistake if they didn't address the position at all...but to what extent is the debate at hand. Do you use a first rounder or wait for a later round? Do you look at free agency only or at all? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragon Posted February 9, 2015 Author Share Posted February 9, 2015 It'd be a mistake if they didn't address the position at all...but to what extent is the debate at hand. Do you use a first rounder or wait for a later round? Do you look at free agency only or at all? The good thing about this draft is that it's so deep for WRs so even if we don't go wr in the first we should still see good value in the next few rounds. My stance is firmly behind drafting vs free agency in this instance simply because of the money aspect. If we could land another stud and pair him up with OBJ for the next 4-5 years guaranteed at a decent cost I'd jump on that deal in a second if we address our other areas of concern in free agency and other rounds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herc Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 i generally like to address high athletic skill positions like wr/rb etc in the draft since those positions are starting to get pretty deep and have a short shelf life which make FA signings a bit more risky. ideally though i want the best possible chance at a superstar with a top ten pick. look what adding one did to our offense last season. we took a pretty decent step despite all our free agent signings getting injured Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nas Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 It'd be a mistake if they didn't address the position at all...but to what extent is the debate at hand. Do you use a first rounder or wait for a later round? Do you look at free agency only or at all? The good thing about this draft is that it's so deep for WRs so even if we don't go wr in the first we should still see good value in the next few rounds. My stance is firmly behind drafting vs free agency in this instance simply because of the money aspect. If we could land another stud and pair him up with OBJ for the next 4-5 years guaranteed at a decent cost I'd jump on that deal in a second if we address our other areas of concern in free agency and other rounds. i generally like to address high athletic skill positions like wr/rb etc in the draft since those positions are starting to get pretty deep and have a short shelf life which make FA signings a bit more risky. ideally though i want the best possible chance at a superstar with a top ten pick. look what adding one did to our offense last season. we took a pretty decent step despite all our free agent signings getting injured Definitely spot on... We know the Giants go for BPA available so you really can't go wrong there.. it's just my hope is we address the defense because having a shitty defense takes years out of our lives... How many times do we have to endure never being able to get off the field... The atrocious days of the times when our offense sucked major balls were tempered by having a defense (i.e. John Fox's) when we needed a 3 and out we knew we can get them... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gmenroc Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 The good thing about this draft is that it's so deep for WRs so even if we don't go wr in the first we should still see good value in the next few rounds. My stance is firmly behind drafting vs free agency in this instance simply because of the money aspect. If we could land another stud and pair him up with OBJ for the next 4-5 years guaranteed at a decent cost I'd jump on that deal in a second if we address our other areas of concern in free agency and other rounds. Yeah, it's deep at WR...but I still don't think I want one until the 4th round. I think the defense needs some playmakers and the offensive line needs some depth before we take the WR. My early first 4: Landon Collins, SS Alabama Denzel Perryman, ILB Miami Tre Jackson or Josue Matias, OGs Florida State Ty Montgomery, WR Stanford Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragon Posted February 9, 2015 Author Share Posted February 9, 2015 Yeah, it's deep at WR...but I still don't think I want one until the 4th round. I think the defense needs some playmakers and the offensive line needs some depth before we take the WR. My early first 4: Landon Collins, SS Alabama Denzel Perryman, ILB Miami Tre Jackson or Josue Matias, OGs Florida State Ty Montgomery, WR Stanford Lol we agree completely on the 2nd and 3rd round except I want Cameron Erving over both of them. He can play every position on the ol (and because of that probably won't be around then). S is one of those spots I'm wary of because I look at Secondary positions as spots I'd like to have a little experience at when it comes to starters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gmenroc Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 Lol we agree completely on the 2nd and 3rd round except I want Cameron Erving over both of them. He can play every position on the ol (and because of that probably won't be around then). S is one of those spots I'm wary of because I look at Secondary positions as spots I'd like to have a little experience at when it comes to starters. Drafting Collins doesn't eliminate the possibility we re-sign Rolle, or another FA safety to give us that experience, because I agree...having a "QB of the defense" there in the middle of the secondary is helpful in ensuring guys are lined up and know their job. I think the two of them could start next to each other and it'd be a hell of a learning experience for Collins. I should've added that I think we re-sign JPP, Rolle, and Thurmond...Bowman too if $$ allows for it. I think that we should be able to get a quality interior linemen in the 3rd...though we may differ in who that actually ends up being. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragon Posted February 9, 2015 Author Share Posted February 9, 2015 This is true. My reluctance over Collins is due to me wanting a wr and me knowing virtually nothing about him. And if it came to the two you names I'd rather go with Jackson. Matias had major hype and did not live up to it in any way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigblue25 Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 I don't think Collins is a top ten pick. He's not a single high safety type and may be restricted to an in the box safety. There is much better value for safeties in the third like Prewitt or Eskridge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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